OOC -- Iblis
Feb. 28th, 2007 11:35 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
theothermusesI'm still researching the Iblis aspect of Bilis, but this is what I've come up with so far and how it relates to how he'll be played here.
From the research I've done so far, and as with much religious mythoology, there are different interpretations as far as Iblis is concerned. However, there are major points that appear in all of these. I'll be using those and the aspects that fit this version of Iblis the best.
FAQ
Why choose Bilis to be Iblis?
At this point in Torchwood canon it's not known who/what Bilis is. There are theories, and the one I find most credible (and that I personally like) is that he is Iblis. I find that one name is an anagram of the other to be far more than coincidental, especially as Torchwood = Doctor Who.
Who was Iblis?
Iblis is a Jinn.
What's a Jinn?
The Jinn come from the Qu'ran. They are demons or devils or evil spirits. They were created by God over 25,000 years ago out of fire. When the Jinn disobeyed God, he sent Angels down to destroy them. In their true form, the Jinn are too horrific for humans to see, and they come in many forms...assuming any one they wish and can pretty much do anything they want. They are mortal, but are extremely long lived and the only way they can be detected is through their deeds which are too terrible for un-possessed humans to commit.
How did Iblis come to be?
Iblis was spared during the battle with the Angels, and God saw in him his potential to be worthy of being taught by the Angels. However, when God created Adam, Iblis refused God's command to kneel before man, claiming that he was superior being made out of fire than Adam made from the earth. God then cast Iblis out of Heaven, but allowed Iblis to tempt humanity until Judgement Day. He can tempt anyone who is not God or one of his servants. According to the Qu'ran, he tempted Eve with the apple.
So Iblis is the Devil?
In a way. He is the Qu'ranic version of the Devil familiar to Christianity. In fact, his other name is Shaitan or Shaytan. But he is not Lucifer. Iblis, though fallen is not a Fallen Angel
What powers does Iblis/Bilis have?
As said above, his powers are pretty much limitless except against God and his servants. As Torchwood canon shows, he can simply step through time (and space) to any period he wishes. To tempt people, he basically lays out false suggestion through whispers or visions to get them to perform evil. Free will plays a major plays a major part, and he is not able to tempt every human. But as shown in Torchwood, he succeeds in manipulating Gwen, Owen, Ianto, and Tosh with visions of loved ones...it's only Jack who is not affected. Maybe Bilis tried, but Jack didn't succumb or he didn't try knowing the effort may not work and was not needed.
You said that the Jinn can change form, can Iblis/Bilis?
Yes. Although canon has only shown Bilis as an old man -- IMO an effective guise as it makes him seem fairly harmless -- he can take on other forms. Perhaps it was him who appeared to the team taking on the form of, for example, Lisa for Ianto...instead of simply a vision. To quote Murray Melvin, "He can be all things to all men."
In End of Days, Bilis says, "I look upon my god and know my work is done," in reference to Abaddon. How do account for that?
Admittedly, this is the one part that gives me some trouble. I really see it as weak writing, as with all Bilis has done, I just don't find it credible that he is merely a worshipper of this 'god.' Additionally, as Iblis he knows of the One True God and would hardly follow what turns out to be such a weak one. Perhaps he was just using hyperbole to impress Torchwood or caught up in the moment.
My own opinion, using the Iblis theory, is that Abbadon is another demon that has been imprisoned (by God?) under the Rift. Iblis, in an effort to bring about Endtimes, wishes to release this terror on the world to destroy the humanity he despises and waited decades for the right moment that he could use Torchwood to do it for him.
Are other pups going to know what he is?
Generally no. Gabriel knows exactly who he is, of course. Jack and the rest of Torchwood 3, know that he is evil, some of the things he's capable of, but as yet not his true identity...though they are free to figure it out. Same with the Doctor and Rose. Those with psychic capabilities may be able to detect a sense of darkness or evil about him...or that he's 'dodgy.' Normal humans will just see an old man, unless he chooses to reveal things about himself.
Will you always play him as an old man
For the vast majority of play and all prompts, yes, Bilis will appear as he did in Torchwood. There may be occasions when he takes on another form, and I'll use appropriate icons when he does.
His function is to tempt mankind into evil. Will he do this in-game?
I'd love for him to do this, especially send visions to other characters. As he does this to manipulate them to his will, I will of course, not do so without the other writer's consent. But I hope that some will be willing to play along.
What if Bilis turns out to be something totally different in canon?
Then I'm screwed!
How can players contact you?
It's best to email me at jayesmuses @ gmail.com (just remove the spaces). Or leave a message here (both IC and OOC).
Sources for information on the Jinn and Iblis taken from:
http://web.uvic.ca/~rpn/files/iblis.html
http://www.deliriumsrealm.com/delirium/articleview.asp?Post=171
and http://www.pantheon.org
Disclaimer: Bilis is the property of Russell T. Davies and the BBC, I'm just exploring this possibility of this character for enjoyment and mean no infraction by it. I'm also by no means a religious scholar/student, so if I have anything fundamentally wrong, just leave me a (polite) note...I'm always happy to learn and correct my mistakes.
From the research I've done so far, and as with much religious mythoology, there are different interpretations as far as Iblis is concerned. However, there are major points that appear in all of these. I'll be using those and the aspects that fit this version of Iblis the best.
FAQ
Why choose Bilis to be Iblis?
At this point in Torchwood canon it's not known who/what Bilis is. There are theories, and the one I find most credible (and that I personally like) is that he is Iblis. I find that one name is an anagram of the other to be far more than coincidental, especially as Torchwood = Doctor Who.
Who was Iblis?
Iblis is a Jinn.
What's a Jinn?
The Jinn come from the Qu'ran. They are demons or devils or evil spirits. They were created by God over 25,000 years ago out of fire. When the Jinn disobeyed God, he sent Angels down to destroy them. In their true form, the Jinn are too horrific for humans to see, and they come in many forms...assuming any one they wish and can pretty much do anything they want. They are mortal, but are extremely long lived and the only way they can be detected is through their deeds which are too terrible for un-possessed humans to commit.
How did Iblis come to be?
Iblis was spared during the battle with the Angels, and God saw in him his potential to be worthy of being taught by the Angels. However, when God created Adam, Iblis refused God's command to kneel before man, claiming that he was superior being made out of fire than Adam made from the earth. God then cast Iblis out of Heaven, but allowed Iblis to tempt humanity until Judgement Day. He can tempt anyone who is not God or one of his servants. According to the Qu'ran, he tempted Eve with the apple.
So Iblis is the Devil?
In a way. He is the Qu'ranic version of the Devil familiar to Christianity. In fact, his other name is Shaitan or Shaytan. But he is not Lucifer. Iblis, though fallen is not a Fallen Angel
What powers does Iblis/Bilis have?
As said above, his powers are pretty much limitless except against God and his servants. As Torchwood canon shows, he can simply step through time (and space) to any period he wishes. To tempt people, he basically lays out false suggestion through whispers or visions to get them to perform evil. Free will plays a major plays a major part, and he is not able to tempt every human. But as shown in Torchwood, he succeeds in manipulating Gwen, Owen, Ianto, and Tosh with visions of loved ones...it's only Jack who is not affected. Maybe Bilis tried, but Jack didn't succumb or he didn't try knowing the effort may not work and was not needed.
You said that the Jinn can change form, can Iblis/Bilis?
Yes. Although canon has only shown Bilis as an old man -- IMO an effective guise as it makes him seem fairly harmless -- he can take on other forms. Perhaps it was him who appeared to the team taking on the form of, for example, Lisa for Ianto...instead of simply a vision. To quote Murray Melvin, "He can be all things to all men."
In End of Days, Bilis says, "I look upon my god and know my work is done," in reference to Abaddon. How do account for that?
Admittedly, this is the one part that gives me some trouble. I really see it as weak writing, as with all Bilis has done, I just don't find it credible that he is merely a worshipper of this 'god.' Additionally, as Iblis he knows of the One True God and would hardly follow what turns out to be such a weak one. Perhaps he was just using hyperbole to impress Torchwood or caught up in the moment.
My own opinion, using the Iblis theory, is that Abbadon is another demon that has been imprisoned (by God?) under the Rift. Iblis, in an effort to bring about Endtimes, wishes to release this terror on the world to destroy the humanity he despises and waited decades for the right moment that he could use Torchwood to do it for him.
Are other pups going to know what he is?
Generally no. Gabriel knows exactly who he is, of course. Jack and the rest of Torchwood 3, know that he is evil, some of the things he's capable of, but as yet not his true identity...though they are free to figure it out. Same with the Doctor and Rose. Those with psychic capabilities may be able to detect a sense of darkness or evil about him...or that he's 'dodgy.' Normal humans will just see an old man, unless he chooses to reveal things about himself.
Will you always play him as an old man
For the vast majority of play and all prompts, yes, Bilis will appear as he did in Torchwood. There may be occasions when he takes on another form, and I'll use appropriate icons when he does.
His function is to tempt mankind into evil. Will he do this in-game?
I'd love for him to do this, especially send visions to other characters. As he does this to manipulate them to his will, I will of course, not do so without the other writer's consent. But I hope that some will be willing to play along.
What if Bilis turns out to be something totally different in canon?
Then I'm screwed!
How can players contact you?
It's best to email me at jayesmuses @ gmail.com (just remove the spaces). Or leave a message here (both IC and OOC).
Sources for information on the Jinn and Iblis taken from:
http://web.uvic.ca/~rpn/files/iblis.html
http://www.deliriumsrealm.com/delirium/articleview.asp?Post=171
and http://www.pantheon.org
Disclaimer: Bilis is the property of Russell T. Davies and the BBC, I'm just exploring this possibility of this character for enjoyment and mean no infraction by it. I'm also by no means a religious scholar/student, so if I have anything fundamentally wrong, just leave me a (polite) note...I'm always happy to learn and correct my mistakes.
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
no subject
Date: 2007-02-28 01:12 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-02-28 03:06 pm (UTC)I'm just a sucker for a bad guy. *g* And he just struck me during "Captain Jack Harkness" when I wasn't concetrating on Jack/Jack...it was kind of inevitable that I pick him up. Although if I hadn't come across the whole Iblis thing...that just gives him so many layers to work with.
Thanks.*g* Still feeling him out, but getting this kind of stuff written down really helps me.
no subject
Date: 2007-02-28 03:51 pm (UTC)Bilis did give me the creeps, more so because we know there will be more of it. It's nice to see someone attempting to flush out someone like him, make him interesting. My inner Gwen is rather worried though.
no subject
Date: 2007-02-28 09:39 pm (UTC)He is creepy, and I love it. I write other bad guys, but they're more just out and out baddies...none are quite as creepily evil as Bilis. And Bilis is smiling at your Gwen.
no subject
Date: 2007-02-28 06:28 pm (UTC)Also I just got accepted as Crowley from Good Omens, don't know if you know the fandom, but he's also the snake that tempted Eve (could lead to an interesting arguement there) he's also a fallen angel so I was wondering if you thought he'd know Iblis, or maybe just sense the evil/outcast from Heaven in him?
no subject
Date: 2007-02-28 09:43 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-02-28 09:48 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-02-28 10:05 pm (UTC)And I friended him. *g*
no subject
Date: 2007-02-28 10:06 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-02-28 10:12 pm (UTC)And thank you, I love Depeche Mode and Dave Gahan in particular, it's my dream to find a Martin Gore Aziraphale actually.
no subject
Date: 2007-03-02 08:13 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-03-02 03:50 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-03-04 03:30 pm (UTC)